1st time painting a vehicle...

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:43 pm
hey all, new here to the forums. As some may know, the early '90s model GM & Chevy vehicles had some problems with the basecoat not staying on the primer, and my '91 s10 is no exception. I finally decided to do something about it. So I started with just a scraper blade, could not believe how much paint actually came off the truck. Primer still good though! Truck has zero rust spots. Now working on sanding this thing down.....

Now for the paint questions.....
THIS IS STRICTLY A BUDGET PAINT JOB. This is my work truck, not a show truck. I know, I know, if I'm gonna do it, I need to do it right, right? Well, money is a huge factor here. The least I can do is to make sure I get every bit of the old basecoat off the truck, don't really know if i need to worry about the factory primer too?

Anyways, here are my paint questions......
I managed to get ahold of a gallon of sherwin williams alkyd enamel paint for free. What primer should I lay down under this paint? Or does it even need primer?
Reducer..... Mineral spirits ok? What ratio?
Is hardener needed with this paint?

Thanks for any help.....

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:40 pm
Yikes! I'm sorry to hear that your basecoat all came off. Alkyd enamel is kinda old technology and not nearly as durable as newer urethane paints. If you are sure you want to go with alkyd enamel, I suggest scuffing the primer old primer at very least, perhaps do a wetsand with some 400 grit sandpaper. Mineral spirits will work as a reducing agent but it is not ideal. Sherwin Williams makes an acrylic enamel reducer that is the same price as mineral spirits but better suited for the job, also pick up some acrylic enamel hardener. Beware however: hardener contains isocyanites so be sure to have some airflow and wear at least an active charcoal mask while painting and mixing.
If I were to do a budget job, I would buy some cheap single stage urethane enamel (kirker sells it at under 100 dollars per gallon, including reducer) and some 2k primer (kirker sells for around 70 a gallon). Scuff the OEM primer with 220 or 360 grit paper and then shoot the 2k primer. Block sand the primer flat and then shoot the urethane. Then you're done! Kirker sells a kit that includes clearcoat but it is a bit more involved, the price (shipped) for the primer, base and clear is around 200 dollars. Just a thought!



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:25 pm
Thanks for the input! I've never really messed around with auto paint, so I don't have a clue what's available. At my work, this paint I've got is used to paint the machines and stuff. How is the uv tolerance of this urethane stuff?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:43 pm
Depends on the brand and if you clear it or not. It (for the most part) is much better than acrylic enamel. Acrylic (alkyd) enamel is basically glorified tool and implement paint. They did use it as OEM car paint for a while but then they switched to Urethane. Almost all OEM finishes are urethane enamel (also called acrylic urethane). I would expect a decent single-stage urethane to use 7 years at the very least and an acrylic enamel to last maybe 4-5. What kind of equipment do you have? I would be more comfortable using acrylic enamel if you have minimal protection and airflow. Less toxic (especially if you don't use the hardener).



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:57 pm
Equipment wise, an old siphon feed gun, a big air compressor, & a big shop. Its just my work truck, if the paint lasts 2 years, I will be happy with that

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:04 pm
In that case I would go with the acrylic enamel. Mask everything you don't want paint on, Remove all prior basecoat, scuff the primer with 400 grit wet sandpaper, wash the car with dawn dish soap, use wax and grease remover (cheap, you can find it at autozone or sherwin williams, make sure to always wipe in the same direction and use one rag to apply and another to wipe off), mix your acrylic enamel with reducer and hardener and spray that truck. There should be mixing and spraying and re-coat instructions on the gallon of paint. After you're done you should wait a while, perhaps let it bake on in the sun after it dries and then you can buff it. Most people recommend waiting a month or two before waxing any kind of fresh paint. I'm just a newbie myself but I feel fairly confident with acrylic enamel paints.



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:05 pm
I used Krker acrylic enamel for practicing, and without the hardener, it doesn't last. The pieces I painted with the hardener kept a shine. I used a carbon mask, and it worked fine with the hardener or without.
For the difference in price between the SS enamel and urethane, I'd go with the urethane. You can find solid colors on ebay from Pivco. I bought paint and other supplies from them, and they ship very quickly. You can also order from their website, pivco.net but I find it easier to order from them through ebay.
Search through their ebay store. You can usually find a color that's cheaper than others.
Also, get yourself a mask or two, one or two disposable paint suits, and some nitrile gloves. All are inexpensive, but invaluable for your health.
Here's a couple of examples from Pivco. Bear in mind, you'll need reducer and hardener for the enamel, so it's really not that much cheaper:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/WIMBLEDO ... 3a61859429

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/KIRKERS- ... 3a5e6cb988



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:18 am
This is not the kind of reply I imagine we normally see here, but hear me out. Why not just go to Maaco or Earl Scheib? The basic paint job they do costs less than you would spend on materials, plus, while the quality is certainly not the very best, it would probably turn out better than what you could do first time out. You said that top quality was not your goal, so check them both out. I heard a national ad on tv for Maaco, and their entry level jobs start under $300.00. They of course figure that they will get more out of you for body work, but it sounds like you don't need any. I occasionally fix and resell cars, and in the past I have used Maaco 3 times. I did all the prep work myself so I knew it would be right, and all they did was paint. They used PPG products, and all 3 cars were sold to the first person who looked at them. Just a thought!! :drink:
Life is short. Play hard.



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:58 am
I thought about going the maaco route, but then realized, what I don't have money wise, I can more than make up for it in time. I'm not in a rush on this project & really want to do this myself, just because I believe I can. As far as money spent so far, I'm only about $20 into it right now! The paint was free, I already have a sander & a gun, so far, only money spent has been on sandpaper. I even already have tape & paper left over from a different project. I'm just really trying to figure out the best way to use what I've got, which is an alkyd enamel paint. On the side of the gallon can, it doesn't really say how much to reduce, or if it needs a hardener or not.



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:27 am
mark 51 had some good advice, but if you want to do it yourself great. but use some enamel reducer get some dupont 3812 its a fast reducer for cool temps . allso if you can aford it get some alkyd enamel hardener, you don't need it but it helps if you need to repaire something. alkyd enamel usualy reduces 25%. let us know how you are doing as you go :)
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