jeremyb wrote::worthy:




Ah...well you got me. I guess those who TEACH the same thing, you have one over on them also. Carry on with your chemistry and engineer way of doing things...it has gotten you so far here.

I will.. Enjoy your prole life.

A long time ago, (mid 1960's) we were taught in metal shop to avoid 5 solvents when prepping metal for coatings. Lacquer thinner, acetone, denatured alcohol, mineral spirits, and naptha. The reasons? Some leave residues, all dry too fast to ensure all foreign matter was suspended and removed.
Basically, we washed and rinsed the projects, dried with an air hose, then tack ragged before dipping.

Ed...what do you know? Are you a chemist or engineer?

edpol wrote:A long time ago, (mid 1960's) we were taught in metal shop to avoid 5 solvents when prepping metal for coatings. Lacquer thinner, acetone, denatured alcohol, mineral spirits, and naptha. The reasons? Some leave residues, all dry too fast to ensure all foreign matter was suspended and removed.
Basically, we washed and rinsed the projects, dried with an air hose, then tack ragged before dipping.

Well the 'grade' would matter, but they are the main ingredients of the cleaners.

MX190
Naphtha (petroleum), hydrotreated heavy 64742-48-9 30 - 60
Ligroine 8032-32-4 30 - 60
xylene 1330-20-7 0.1 - 1
1,3,5-trimethylbenzene 108-67-8 0.1 - 1
Toluene 108-88-3 0.1 - 1

dx837 is up to 70% naptha.

I believe most waterborne are water and acetone.

While there is chemistry in everything around us there is also accumulated knowledge that can only be gained by experience. You can explain all the chemistry behind why a skunk's spray smells the way it does and it would not deter anyone from getting near a skunk. However let them get sprayed one time and they will have gained immediate wisdom on the subject matter. When they educate their friends and kids on the perils of being too close to a skunk they will refer to the wisdom they have gained via personal experience rather than the chemical theory involved by simply stating - it stinks.
Thus is the dilemma before us. Once deceived by the "just wipe it with lacquer thinner" advice one quickly defers to personal experience when advising others about its adverse affects. Chemical purities and complexities don't even enter into the picture, anymore than they would discussing the potential problems when a skunk is in the yard. The advice is condensed into a simple and easy to understand manner - don't do it.
There are chemical solutions made just for this procedure - use them.

My two cents and worth just what you paid for it.

'68 Coronet R/T wrote: You can explain all the chemistry behind why a skunk's spray smells the way it does and it would not deter anyone from getting near a skunk

Shoot, I don't know about that!

But what I meant was, he did it first (thinner I mean.. it was the first thing he wiped it with.. And I know (No, not a guess. I have found out first hand) there is a LOT of stuff that W&G remover won't even touch, that lacquer thinner will pick up. Maybe there's another option as a stronger solvent you can use as a first wipe to remove the nasty stuff..I don't know. Never have seen it. But it's probably just thinner repackaged. haha

"Most" of the time if you use Lacquer thinner to clean a small area, sand it, then use W&G remover,,,you wont have a problem.

They teach you in school NOT to use it to clean the car with,,"BUT" it can be done. Its just a bad habbit to get into,,,ya know.

jeremyb wrote:Ed...what do you know? Are you a chemist or engineer?

Engineer. I have a model train set.

Well the 'grade' would matter, but they are the main ingredients of the cleaners.

MX190
Naphtha (petroleum), hydrotreated heavy 64742-48-9 30 - 60
Ligroine 8032-32-4 30 - 60
xylene 1330-20-7 0.1 - 1
1,3,5-trimethylbenzene 108-67-8 0.1 - 1
Toluene 108-88-3 0.1 - 1


dx837 is up to 70% naptha.

Notice there's a combination of chemicals. Even at 70% naptha, 30% of other ingredients that don't flash quickly is enough to keep contaminates in suspension long enough to be wiped off.
As for grades, these solvents perform many functions in many industries. For instance, in the shop I worked in, we sprayed lacquer most of the time. If someone used utility grade to mix paint, he'd be fired. Same if he used premium grade to clean his gun.
Straight Dawn or Ajax dishwashing liquid will remove oils, not sure about waxes. Other brands may work too, but those are the only two I used for removing oil stains from my driveway and spills from engine bays. But you wouldn't use them to replace W&G remover for prepping a car for paint.

There are chemical solutions made just for this procedure - use them.

And they ain't that expensive.

edpol wrote:

jeremyb wrote:Ed...what do you know? Are you a chemist or engineer?

Engineer. I have a model train set.

Well the 'grade' would matter, but they are the main ingredients of the cleaners.

MX190
Naphtha (petroleum), hydrotreated heavy 64742-48-9 30 - 60
Ligroine 8032-32-4 30 - 60
xylene 1330-20-7 0.1 - 1
1,3,5-trimethylbenzene 108-67-8 0.1 - 1
Toluene 108-88-3 0.1 - 1


dx837 is up to 70% naptha.

Notice there's a combination of chemicals. Even at 70% naptha, 30% of other ingredients that don't flash quickly is enough to keep contaminates in suspension long enough to be wiped off.
As for grades, these solvents perform many functions in many industries. For instance, in the shop I worked in, we sprayed lacquer most of the time. If someone used utility grade to mix paint, he'd be fired. Same if he used premium grade to clean his gun.
Straight Dawn or Ajax dishwashing liquid will remove oils, not sure about waxes. Other brands may work too, but those are the only two I used for removing oil stains from my driveway and spills from engine bays. But you wouldn't use them to replace W&G remover for prepping a car for paint.

There are chemical solutions made just for this procedure - use them.

And they ain't that expensive.

I DO use them.. Never said I didn't??

"Straight Dawn or Ajax dishwashing liquid will remove oils, not sure about waxes. Other brands may work too, but those are the only two I used for removing oil stains from my driveway and spills from engine bays. But you wouldn't use them to replace W&G remover for prepping a car for paint."

Actually I believe Jcclark does just that?

JohnnyK wrote:

edpol wrote:

jeremyb wrote:Ed...what do you know? Are you a chemist or engineer?

Engineer. I have a model train set.

Well the 'grade' would matter, but they are the main ingredients of the cleaners.

MX190
Naphtha (petroleum), hydrotreated heavy 64742-48-9 30 - 60
Ligroine 8032-32-4 30 - 60
xylene 1330-20-7 0.1 - 1
1,3,5-trimethylbenzene 108-67-8 0.1 - 1
Toluene 108-88-3 0.1 - 1



dx837 is up to 70% naptha.

Notice there's a combination of chemicals. Even at 70% naptha, 30% of other ingredients that don't flash quickly is enough to keep contaminates in suspension long enough to be wiped off.
As for grades, these solvents perform many functions in many industries. For instance, in the shop I worked in, we sprayed lacquer most of the time. If someone used utility grade to mix paint, he'd be fired. Same if he used premium grade to clean his gun.
Straight Dawn or Ajax dishwashing liquid will remove oils, not sure about waxes. Other brands may work too, but those are the only two I used for removing oil stains from my driveway and spills from engine bays. But you wouldn't use them to replace W&G remover for prepping a car for paint.

There are chemical solutions made just for this procedure - use them.

And they ain't that expensive.

I DO use them.. Never said I didn't??

"Straight Dawn or Ajax dishwashing liquid will remove oils, not sure about waxes. Other brands may work too, but those are the only two I used for removing oil stains from my driveway and spills from engine bays. But you wouldn't use them to replace W&G remover for prepping a car for paint."

Actually I believe Jcclark does just that?

Think JC uses furniture polish to tack with before top coat too.....never tried it (not knocking you JC) I only use what I know works for me.