HI everyone, I’m a small time guitar builder & I use Nason primer, base & 2k clear coat
The issue I’m having is this…when I do a natural wood finish when all I did was seal the wood & add clear I’m good, I also do finishes after its primed & sanded, I dip the guitar body in water with paint on top (swirling) then I wait 2 days & clear & I’m good.

Here is where the issue is, when I use base coat I have tried waiting a day before clear & I have tried shooting the clear after the base has dried about an hour & after 2-3 coats of clear & about 6 -10 hours later I notice the solvent pop starts & it looks like its deep under the clear like coming off the base…it’s really noticeable on black red & blue colors….itty bitty bitty white dots on the base coat that only appears after the clear is shot & starts to cure & gets worse within the 3 days before I wet sand…again I’m doing nothing different in applying my clear from the other 2 ways above…the only thing I can think of is:

I use preval sprayers on the base coat so I don’t have to pull out my spray rig & maybe the aerosol is contaminating the base?…or the nason base reducer I’m using somehow went bad?...I was going to do a test on some black with some scrap wood with my hvlp gun to see if it still happens
Anyone think they have an idea?
Thanks,
-mark

Mark,
I think you are more than likely running into a "chemistry" problem.... Automotive base coats are not really designed to dry in the presence of moisture. In other words metals have no moisture content. The kiln dried wood you are working with has at least a 6% EMC (equillibrium of moisture content) rating I am sure. If you also combine that with the natural oils and the long tube cell structure of wood these bases just are not drying properly for you. They were designed to work and "flash" off of dry surface.

sounds like an interesting project. i'm with Darrel I don't think base coat likes water very well. base coat is in the lacquer family and lacquer is real sensitive to moisture. JUST AN IDEA but you might try a urethane or even try some One Shot enamel. you might need to reduce it to get it to lay on the water properly and you should mix a little of the clear catalyst in the One Shot. you'll still be able to use your same clear. keep us up to date on this, I like oddball projects like this its a chance for me to learn something.

Yeah, badsix is on the right path there. You've got to use base colors that can "tolerate" those characteristics of the wood. Another thing you might experiment with is something like AutoAir Colors or there somewhat cheaper line which is Wicked. You can actually use a heat gun or even simple hair dryer to quickly force cure them so you can move on with your clear. I've done some experimentation with those over the years on special wood projects and have found them to tolerate both the wood surface and the application of the auto urethanes over top.

You guys may be on to something here...I never thought of that & now that I think of it this has never been an always problem, I have done some guitars with nason base that has been fine & some that this happens which tells me that I could be some of the body blanks I’m using that are not 100 % or enough dry to tolerate the base…I do notice some guitar builders seal the wood no matter what kind of wood it is, I only seal it if it’s a porous grain…I’m wondering if I always seal the wood if it would help & now I know why they always do…I just figured with non-porous woods the nason primer is like liquid bondo & would be enough. You guys have made some serious lights go off in my head…I just picked up more black base nason & I have plenty of scrap wood of different kinds & same kind, even have some scrap wood of what gave me the SP. The sealer I use for the natural grain porous wood finishes is an epoxy base called Zpoxy, im going to for sure try that before the primer then base & see if it helps…
Thanks again, I’ll keep you posted!
You guys rock!
Btw, its not that I don’t want to invest in the enamel..it’s just I have so much base left & feel id rather see if I can get thru this first!

here is my website if you want to check me out

www.funkguitarsusa.com

NICE WORK ! I've done some wood before but would be shooting for the hip with any more advice. I think your at the point were you just have to experiment. Darrel will be your man here.
Jay D.

Nice guitars.....Okay, some things with "treating" new woods before you work them. First, I'd invest in a hand held moisture meter like a Mini-Ligno or something like that. All new fresh kiln dried woods should be coming to you at 6% or less. If its' old stock or has been sitting on somebody's shelf for awhile it can be 12% plus. Law of wood physics #1. Wood must be under 12% before it can be worked in anyway which means gluing, finishing, shaping, etc. Law of wood physics #2. All wood should be either sized, pre-sealed, or sealed before any type of stain, paint, or coating system is applied. Sizing agents are usually glue based (this is more high tech. and what we use in shop). Pre-sealers are solvent based like very diluted fresh shellac or diluted lacquer or vanish sealers. Sealers are higher solids lacquer or varnish sealers. Your wood will ALWAYS benefit from one of these three pretreatment methods. They will stabilize the moisture content of the upper 10% of the wood, they will even out hard and soft areas allowing for stains to take more evenly, they will stop the rapid penetration of stain or paint on end grain, they will stop your finish from "dropping" further into the pore structure, they will decrease your coating usage, and on and on..... Bottom line.... all manufacturers use one of those methods for treating their wood before working it. You'll have to experiment with one of them to see what works for you. We use a varying percentage solution of synthetic glue and hot water to produce a sizing agent that we use on just about any production work that we do.
You know....my wife and I were very lucky to get into the wood biz. when we did...get this...large furniture and wood manufacturers would allow us to come in and see their processes and get tech. support from their finishing dept. They'd actually give us service manuals on how to repair (sealers, stains, finishes,etc.) their pieces....so then all the manufacturing went off shore.... and so went the quality furniture......

Thanks so much !!
gonna pick up a meter today...dying to know what my wood stock is reading!
& thanks so much for letting me hang out in here, i know nothing about fixing dents etc but somewhat we are doing the same thing when it comes to shooting the paint we use.
cheers!
-M