Iwata vs Devilbiss

Any questions about tools or supplies. Post your compressor/gun questions here.



Non-Lurker
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:18 pm
Location: Western North Carolina
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:50 pm
Soon going to purchase a spray gun. I was going with the Devilbiss Finish line FLG4. Then I saw an Iwata AirGunsa HVLP 9276 for $234.99. The Devilbiss is $215. The both come with 3 fluid tips. Does one have any advantage over the other? Anyone have a preference for one or the other? Thanks!

User avatar

Top Contributor
Posts: 2773
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:46 am
Location: Canberra
Country:
Australia
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:23 pm
Before you look at brands, consider where you are, what you will be doing and what other equipment you have, or will have.

Unless you live in a mandated area HVLP is not necessary. HVLP uses a lot more air than RP (Reduced Pressure, a.k.a. "compliant") and finish quality is generally not as good. Even for experienced painters HVLP is more difficult to use. Consider that here in Australia (where HVLP is not required) almost no pro painters use HVLP guns for finish coats and while lots of (purported) HVLP guns are sold, they're sold to people who don't know any better, i.e. amateurs.

Will you be painting lots of whole vehicles or large panels? Or smaller pieces? Or a mix? If large panels or whole cars then a gun with a very wide fan will be an advantage but otherwise it will either make it difficult and/or waste a lot of paint that doesn't hit the part you're painting.

How big is your compressor and what size are your lines? Many HVLP guns demand more air than the average compressor can deliver. So, either you'll be spraying with less than optimal volume or playing the wait and catch up game. Either way is not good for the best results.

Now consider what you really need. Most people use a 1.8mm tip gun for primers and a 1.3mm or 1.4mm for finish coats. 1.4mm is good for 2K or single stage hardened urethane paints while 1.3mm is usually better for basecoats and clears, although 1.2mm is becoming more popular for HS clears due to its ability to atomise a bit finer. So, do you really need 3 different sizes or would 2 be enough?

Also consider convenience. Changing needles, fluid tips and aircaps is a PITA. That's why I have 24 guns - so that I can just grab the one that's right for the job, even though I have lots of alternate setups for most of my guns. I only have one 2.5mm and it's lucky to get used once a year.

Now to the actual guns.

Both the guns you're considering are entry level candidates from major manufacturers. This is good in the sense that both Iwata/Air Gunsa and Devilbiss have the knowledge, experience and technology to make world class sprayguns. However, in the case of Devilbiss, they make some compromises in production quality in order to market at the price point that they pitch the FLG at. The gun body is cast, not machined, so the same levels of accuracy aren't necessarily achieved as they are with their premium products. Other components are also not quite of the same quality as their more expensive ranges. That's not to say that they're junk, definitely not, at least not like their SLG series which very quickly made their way to my bin.

The FLG4 is an old model gun that, apart from being HVLP, was superceded by the FLG5 quite some years ago. The FLG5 is a much better gun. Seriously, much better. Big wide and even fan, excellent atomisation and nice to use. Downside? Only available in 1.4mm and 1.8mm, which is intentional so as not to take too many sales from their flagship models. They suffer from the usual Devilbiss problem of build-up in the neck where the pot screws in and they're a bit fussy to clean. If well maintained they are a very good gun and great value at the price.

Iwata own Air Gunsa and the gun you're looking at is actually the AZ3 HTE2. This gun grew from Air Gunsa's flagship model so the same compromises in production quality have not been made as with the FLG from Devilbiss. Available in a very wide range of tip sizes, they're quite popular here as primer guns in the 1.8mm and bigger. Why? Because they're built strong to take the abuse that apprentices give them, and just come back for more. I have 2 and they are my "go to" guns for medium size jobs like bars or guards, where a big fan can be a disadvantage. Super easy to clean and ultra reliable. A major factor for me is that these guns can produce whatever finish I want with just small changes in settings and technique. They're also available in special models for primer and heavy coatings with options like pressurised, air assisted pots. Downsides? Smaller fan makes big panels a chore and the plastic used in the cup stains easily. Lid design is a little difficult to clean but seals well and the anti-drip breather works flawlessly.

Finally, are the deals you're looking at, good? I think you could do better. First by looking at RP guns and second by looking a bit further afield.

Australian retailers have long been known as money hungry thieves, demanding double the prices that are available elsewhere. The internet and a few new players are changing that, but we are still asked to pay more. North American retailers are more price conscious, but they're lazy and not many could be bothered making the effort to sell overseas, which is kind of understandable given the size of the domestic market. So, I learnt, long ago that while there are the occasional good deals out of North America, generally I buy my sprayguns from England. They're super competitive, having to operate in a big and tough market and they're very much in tune with selling overseas, something they do every day. Royal Mail put USPS and Australia Post to shame. I bought a new gun a couple of weeks ago and it was here, delivered, in 3 working days.

So......

FLG5 with 1.4mm setup for $128USD. Extra needle and fluid tip, $37USD. Link here

Iwata AZ3 HTE2 with 1.3mm setup for $103USD. Extra needle, fluid tip and aircap $84USD. Link here

Yes, you'll have to pay freight, allow around $25USD. You don't have to pay VAT which is only for domestic and EU customers.

End of a very long ramble but this question is asked constantly and I want to be able to answer by just linking to this in the future. Let us know what you decide.
Chris



Non-Lurker
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:18 pm
Location: Western North Carolina
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:09 pm
Wow! I never expected an answer like this, with so much useful information. I am just a hobbyist that is hoping to paint one or two complete vehicles. I did not realize that HVLP was not the preferred way. I will be looking at the links you provided and probably rereading the rest of your post several times. I thought I had read a lot, but have never had it explained this way. Thank you again for taking the time to write this. I will let you know what I purchase. I may ask more questions too!

Mike



Fully Engaged
Posts: 250
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:16 pm
Location: Shelton, CT
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 12:03 am
I hope this helps.

I spray cars as a hobby and spray maybe 1 car a year, own a FLG4 but did not like how it sprayed last time I used it and wanted to see all the rage over expensive guns myself. I was able to borrow a tekna prolite and Iwata LPH-400.

The Prolite needed a much higher pressure it sprayed well but I had to be much quicker with it, the Iwata is much more forgiving for a hobbyist painting in a garage it sprays much slower so you really need to mess up to produce a run. I was able to spray base coat and clear coat with the LPH-400 using a single 1.4 mm tip /silver cap @ 16 PSI and it sprayed the clear like glass. Being that the gun sprays so well at 16 PSI and uses only about 9CFM a smaller air compressor will keep up with it better, it also keeps a lot of the dust off the paint as it moves a softer amount of air and doesn't pick up trash from places it shouldn't. The overspray is very low.


Now I know both of these guns are above your price range new but since you are in the states you can find a used, in good condition, LPH-400 for $200-250, I paid $350 for mine used but it came with a silver and orange cap the gun looked brand new.

On a side note I also used the Spray it 33000 LVLP it is a clone of the LPH-400 and for about $40 it too sprays very well, the quality of the job heavily comes down to the user and prep work.

User avatar

No Turning Back
Posts: 774
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:06 pm
Location: I live in a house
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:21 am
My advise as a weekender rookie garage hack, buy the Air Gunza and use it for primer.
I use mine with a hose sized 3.0 for G2 Feather Fill.

Now if your planning to be doing one or two cars, you’ll end up doing more. Just get a good gun now, that Iwata is a great gun, Sagola 4600 is what I’ve been using and I love mine. You can pick up a used Pro lite pretty cheap. I was amazed how much easier it is painting with a good gun. An ANI F150 from that same site is a good starter gun, it is what I use for flakes.

If you think those guns are expensive, add up how much you will be paying for primers, paint, base coat, sandpaper etc etc.
Sent by the random thoughts from the voices in my head...



Settled In
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:18 pm

Country:
USA
PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 6:21 am
my 2-cents - if considering the air gunsa look into an iwata w-400 bellaria. i'm not a professional painter, but a passionate hobbyist. I have the pro-lite, several iwata w-400 bellaria's (1.3, 1.8 ), and an air gunsa (3.0). dollar for dollar, the best bang for the buck is the iwata w-400 bellaria. IMO, the iwata is the better quality gun. as stated, many things to consider, but if everything's on a level playing field, the w-400 bellaria tops my list. :goodjob:



Non-Lurker
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:18 pm
Location: Western North Carolina
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:37 pm
Thank you everyone for the replies and info.

I will most likely be purchasing the Iwata AZ3 HTE2 with 1.3mm .

I will be spraying my truck with Tamco HP6000 sealer, Tamco white basecoat, and the 2100 clear.

Should I purchase the 1.5mm fluid needle etc as well, or will the 1.3 work for this?

Thanks

Mike

User avatar

No Turning Back
Posts: 774
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:06 pm
Location: I live in a house
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:35 pm
I'd get the 1.5 or larger for HB primers
Sent by the random thoughts from the voices in my head...

User avatar

Board Moderator
Posts: 9878
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:40 pm
Location: ARIZONA
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 8:49 pm
Mike70 wrote:Thank you everyone for the replies and info.

I will most likely be purchasing the Iwata AZ3 HTE2 with 1.3mm .

I will be spraying my truck with Tamco HP6000 sealer, Tamco white basecoat, and the 2100 clear.

Should I purchase the 1.5mm fluid needle etc as well, or will the 1.3 work for this?

Thanks

Mike


If you don't plan to shoot any 2k build primer or polyester primer the 1.3 will work.
1968 Coronet R/T


ACTS 16:31



Non-Lurker
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:18 pm
Location: Western North Carolina
Country:
USA
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2019 12:47 am
Not planning on shooting any high build primer on this project, so I will go with the 1.3.

Thanks, Mike
Next

Return to Tools and Supplies

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 41 guests