Paint Booth

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 4:13 pm
Where are you building this shop? Out in the country on 100 acres with no (phone calling) neighbors? A residential area backing up to your neighbor's pool and bbq area? A commercial area that will be inspected annually? All have some different design criteria - be thankful that you aren't in California.

Check out these guys for fans, they are a great source. https://www.industrialfansdirect.com/

When you go over to explosion proof fans the price jumps up - but I assume it is better than starting a fire. A few years ago when I started painting out in my Pig Barn Shop, I used to worry a lot about my exhaust fan, but knock on wood I haven't blown up (yet!).

For fan size, assuming all else is equal, the larger the fan blades the less rpm the fan should be able to spin as there is a direct relationship between flow (Q), velocity (Vs) and cross sectional area (A).

For wiring, run 240V if you can and use contactors (relays).
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 5:03 pm
PainterDave wrote:That is incorrect on lighting buddy. aim for 90CRI and above. do not go by the Kelvin scale


Not incorrect but I didn't fully explain CRI, I know, although I did reference it. The other half of my business is retrofitting headlights, which I've been doing for over 15 years.

I was keeping it simple because most LEDs don't quote CRI in their specs and when they do it's often BS anyway.

I use this little graphic quite regularly to show the shortcomings of LEDs.
daylight-vs_incan_vs_halogen_spectrum.png


As I said, you can get LEDs that render colours better (high CRI), but they're more expensive. I don't believe you should even try to colour match in the booth - do that outside, before you paint. But, in saying that, booth lighting should at least render colours equally poorly across the spectrum, which is why the high K temps fail with a big blue spike and, worse, insufficient in the yellow to red spectrum. Lower Kelvin temperatures at least have a bit more in the 550+nm range so colours at least look a bit more natural.
Chris

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 5:52 pm
Polish Painter wrote:Anyone have pictures of their exhaust fan area ?? Necessary to build a filter area enclosing the fan ?? 110 V or 220 V ??


As I said earlier, you do need an exhaust plenum with filter. Here is the one I had in the shop. Professionally designed but would have worked better if it had been on the ground, or near to and a bit bigger. Ideally mount so the filter is level with the wall with the plenum behind. I had no choice in this case since the front, glass, windows of the shop made it impossible. Note how the top of the plenum angles to the fan.

That fan was 415V, 3 phase, but our electricity system is 240V, not 110V.

Polish Painter wrote:Maybe put doors on end with filters . Any particular brand you recommend? Do you guys use a variable speed fan ??


Also, as I said before, mount inlet filters in the ceiling rather than the doors, if possible. I had mine in the doors and had trouble balancing the flow at that end, needing to add inlets above the doors.

Specific filters are available for both intake and exhaust. The inlet ones are good and last for a long time but the exhaust filters are expensive. Instead I used polyester wadding, probably available from a sewing supplies shop, which was cheap and very effective. I changed it weekly which was, typically, about 12-15 jobs, so cost was about $2/week.

Don't bother about a variable speed fan
Chris



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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:05 pm
I will be building in the center of my 6 acres , in the woods.
Do you guys have your air compressor in an insulated room as to reduce noise ??
Ok to put a couple of outlets in booth for running my buffer ?
Bitterness of a poor quality job long remains after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:32 pm
Reducing compressor noise is up to you but many do put the unit outside. Enclosing a compressor in a small compartment may reduce noise but sometimes doesn't allow sufficient cooling or air flow.

I've never liked the idea of buffing or polishing inside the booth. Even using "silicone free", 'paint safe' products can result in the booth becoming contaminated and fisheyes in the subsequent jobs.
Chris

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 8:19 pm
Polish Painter wrote:I will be building in the center of my 6 acres , in the woods.

You should be golden, when I build my new shop I am going to put in four fans framed in 24" bays at the exhaust end. Two low and two above those. They will be on two different switches.

Do you guys have your air compressor in an insulated room as to reduce noise ??
Ok to put a couple of outlets in booth for running my buffer ?

A while back when I got a new compressor, I built a new little shed (on the left in the first photo). Just make sure it is big enough to work on it comfortably. Mine sets so it never gets any sun or rain on it and has plenty of ventilation. I have it setup with a contactor and a timer inside my garage.

The piping goes through the wall into a radiator setup that I have since added auto-drains to.

Compressor -Polar Air (2).jpg

Compressor -Polar Air (3).jpg

Compressor - Rapidair Piping (2).jpg

Auto Drain (2).jpg
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 4:28 pm
Could you please tell me about your blue air lines ??
I have galvanized piping currently.
Bitterness of a poor quality job long remains after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:25 pm
Polish Painter wrote:Could you please tell me about your blue air lines ??
I have galvanized piping currently.


RapidAir - I used the 1 inch Fast Pipe system. https://www.rapidairproducts.com/

Great products, really good to work with. I also have some RapidAir Maxline that goes from the garage that the compressor is at, then underground and over to my Pig Barn and back to the Fast Pipe.

Do NOT use PVC, as it is very dangerous.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 11:13 am
NFT5 wrote:
PainterDave wrote:That is incorrect on lighting buddy. aim for 90CRI and above. do not go by the Kelvin scale


Not incorrect but I didn't fully explain CRI, I know, although I did reference it. The other half of my business is retrofitting headlights, which I've been doing for over 15 years.

I was keeping it simple because most LEDs don't quote CRI in their specs and when they do it's often BS anyway.

I use this little graphic quite regularly to show the shortcomings of LEDs.
daylight-vs_incan_vs_halogen_spectrum.png


As I said, you can get LEDs that render colours better (high CRI), but they're more expensive. I don't believe you should even try to colour match in the booth - do that outside, before you paint. But, in saying that, booth lighting should at least render colours equally poorly across the spectrum, which is why the high K temps fail with a big blue spike and, worse, insufficient in the yellow to red spectrum. Lower Kelvin temperatures at least have a bit more in the 550+nm range so colours at least look a bit more natural.



Nice post brother !
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 3:21 pm
OldFatBald wrote:
Polish Painter wrote:I will be building in the center of my 6 acres , in the woods.

You should be golden, when I build my new shop I am going to put in four fans framed in 24" bays at the exhaust end. Two low and two above those. They will be on two different switches.

Do you guys have your air compressor in an insulated room as to reduce noise ??
Ok to put a couple of outlets in booth for running my buffer ?

A while back when I got a new compressor, I built a new little shed (on the left in the first photo). Just make sure it is big enough to work on it comfortably. Mine sets so it never gets any sun or rain on it and has plenty of ventilation. I have it setup with a contactor and a timer inside my garage.

The piping goes through the wall into a radiator setup that I have since added auto-drains to. NICE WORK :clap: :clap:
Jay D.

Compressor -Polar Air (2).jpg

Compressor -Polar Air (3).jpg

Compressor - Rapidair Piping (2).jpg

Auto Drain (2).jpg
they say my name is Jay
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