Metal warped after cutting out rusted panel

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:48 am
Hello everyone, I'm replacing most of the rear quarter panel on a 1964 comet. After cutting out a rusted area the remaining metal on the panel warped on me as you can see in the pictures. Could this be due to the lower panel being out of shape before I cut out the bad spot? With the rust being so bad on both sides of the car it's hard to tell what the original shape is. I guess my biggest question is should I cut out all of the Rusted area before I start welding in new metal? I put a new rolling chassis under this car and is it possible that their rear end of the car might have sagged a little bit and put that metal in a bind? I have the body just tacked to the frame, and im thinking that I might need to cut the rear end of the body loose from the frame and try jacking the body up slightly to see if that warpage straighten out . Thanks in advance for all of your help and you all have a Happy Father's Day!
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20200620_043057.jpg
20200620_043246.jpg
20200620_043553.jpg
1964 Galaxie 500 fastback 428 FE
1964 Comet Caliente (red)
1964 Comet Pro Street project (under construction)



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 9:20 am
I don't know what Caused that, But I am thinking the cutting wheel you used maybe?
The heat and pressure of the cutting tool?

The panel could have been under some sorta stress as well before cutting that caused it once you made the cut?

Maybe one of the other guys knows?


I use a Body saw to make cuts like that
Similar to this one
https://www.eastwood.com/air-body-saw.h ... hUQAvD_BwE
Makes a nice clean very thin cut

If you overlay your patch panel over the Top of metal your cutting out you will have a perfect no gap patch for welding.


Is this Body sitting on a Chassis or a Body Dolly? kinda hard to figure out from your description?????
If the rear Body section is sagging yes this is bad and will cause all kinds of metal warping problems!
The Body needs to be fully supported as If its sitting on all 4 wheels with its original frame!!!

On my Firebirds I support them from the Pinch welds on the bottom of the rocker panels.
But it is absolutely critical that you get the body level and strait before cutting and welding. otherwise doors trunks don't open and close right or wont align properly or the Glass wont go in etc.....

I saw a car a Guy had been restoring for years went to put the windshield in it and it had a 1.5-2 inch gap on one side! The Body was tweaked from welding in all the rust repair panels on a Body that wasn't square before welding.
Dennis Barnett
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:25 am
If the other side is still intact you can compare the contours.

Welding in patch panels requires planishing the welds with a hammer and dolly to help prevent shrinking. With your panel already wanting to cave in will increase the problem and could produce oil canning.

You may need to cut your patch to fit closer to the body line. Maybe an 1 - 1 1/2" below it to gain more stability.

Chevman has a sticky post above that covers a lot of this.
1968 Coronet R/T


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:17 am
red lehr wrote: I put a new rolling chassis under this car and is it possible that their rear end of the car might have sagged a little bit and put that metal in a bind?

Yes, its very possible. It looks like the rear is overhanging from just behind the door, and that is a lot to be sticking out when cutting panels off.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 12:20 pm
Got another question, how would I go about measuring the body to tell if the rear end is sagging? I cut the chassis off of the body at the rear end of the car where the bumper mounts are. I tried lifting the rear end of the body in a couple of different places but the buckle in the metal does not want to come out completely. I relieved the metal slightly. I can see where there is a slight dent right behind driver side door where I cut the panel out. If that panel had some previous damage would it possibly buckle when I cut a piece of that panel out? Thanks in advance for all the help!
1964 Galaxie 500 fastback 428 FE
1964 Comet Caliente (red)
1964 Comet Pro Street project (under construction)



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:33 am
red lehr wrote:Got another question, how would I go about measuring the body to tell if the rear end is sagging? I cut the chassis off of the body at the rear end of the car where the bumper mounts are. I tried lifting the rear end of the body in a couple of different places but the buckle in the metal does not want to come out completely.


Is this Body sitting on a Chassis or a Body Dolly? kinda hard to figure out from your description?????
If the rear Body section is sagging yes this is bad and will cause all kinds of metal warping problems!
The Body needs to be fully supported AS IF IT IS sitting on all 4 wheels with its original frame!!!

The tool to measure a car body with is called a Tram gauge you can buy one or make your own.
Dennis Barnett
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:42 am
Thanks Dennis !!
The chassis is sitting on an adjustable jig and the wheels are off the floor. The body is only tacked on the chassis for the time being. I will use the tram gauge idea for sure. I used a 6 foot level just to get a rough idea if there was any sagging and it looks like I'm a 1/4" low. I'll let you know how the tram gauge works out.
The picture kind of shows how the chassis is being supported for the time being.
Red
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20191116_152127.jpg
1964 Galaxie 500 fastback 428 FE
1964 Comet Caliente (red)
1964 Comet Pro Street project (under construction)



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:47 am
I see. Cool project! please more pics!
How are you supporting your quarters and Tail panel while the floor is cut away? They Have to be supported!

I am gonna say that whole back half is sagging really bad and needs to be leveled and supported before any body panel replacement can happen, that stress will cause all kinds of funny thing's to happen! such as that panel popping out once it was cut!

Tram Gauge:
Like i said you can buy one or you can make your own!!! I stress make your own!
If you go to buy one expect prices to be all over the place from inexpensive to super expensive.
It does not need to be super Hi tech or expensive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_I_BCkkazCA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTr5dCj4kis
Dennis Barnett
A&P Mechanic, FCC General radio Telephone Operator
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:40 pm
I figured the most logical place check to check 4 sag in the rear end would be to put a straight edge on the rear quarter panel starting at the door running it to the rear of the car. I checked my measurements against another identical car and my car in the picture seems to be a quarter inch low in the rear end. I have had the rear end supported the whole time during the restoration. Tram gauge measuring to come.
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20191112_043141.jpg
20191204_152152.jpg
20191204_152118.jpg
1964 Galaxie 500 fastback 428 FE
1964 Comet Caliente (red)
1964 Comet Pro Street project (under construction)



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2020 8:10 pm
red lehr wrote: I tried lifting the rear end of the body in a couple of different places but the buckle in the metal does not want to come out completely. I relieved the metal slightly.

I'm not sure what you are seeing, but if you push or pull the sag back in place but the panels don't return, then you may have a crease holding it. When a sag or some kind of damage causes the metal to move beyond it elastic point, then it will crease, and a crease has to be worked out manually, along with pulling or pushing the sag or damage back in place.
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